J-Z18271

Possible time of origin: 4,000-34,000 years before present
Possible place of origin: Western Asia
Defining mutations: M267
Highest frequencies: Semitic populations generally, and also parts of the Caucasus (including Dagestan).

Moderator: napobo3


Posts: 3177
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 8:47 am
And also Cabaon had the "account suspended" in Anthrogenica that very likely will be transformed in a banishment. Perhaps someone thinks that Cabaon is me, but I am not Cabaon. Jews are the same of course.


Originally Posted by Agamemnon
In other words, finding the exact same paternal lineage (found in earlier MBA and EIA samples from Israel) in a majority of Jewish priests regardless of the community (Sephardic, Ashkenazi, Mizrahi, Romaniote, Yemenite, etc) is just a happy coincidence. It had nothing to do either with the Babylonian exile or the later exile of the Jewish-Roman wars, despite its sub-branches having TMRCA estimates corresponding to both events. Just a bunch of eclectic "opportunists settling in different parts of the world"... Where I'm from, we call that a miracle.

Cabaon's answer 
I'll just point out that when Europeans owe anywhere between 30% and 50% of their ancestry to pastoralists from the steppe, many go as far as to call that an invasion. When Jews owe anywhere between 30% and 50% of their ancestry to Iron Age Israelites however, you expect us to pretend that there was no exile (for which there is ample documentation anyway, contra Sand). Without double-standards, people like you would be left with no standards at all.

P.S. If I had access to Anthrogenica I'd say to Agamemnon to post his terminal SNP of his Y and not only J-Z18271 or at least Y67, what he didn't do either when we exchanged tens of letters in the past.

Posts: 3177
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 9:47 am
The oldest separated samples of this subclade J-Z18271* are id: ERS256773ITA [IT-CA], id: YF71301TUR [TR-29] ell, id: HG01571PER [PE-LIM]. None of these had something to do with a Jewish ancestry. All Jewish haplotypes had MRCAs after the diaspora.


https://www.yfull.com/live/tree/J-Z18271/

Posts: 3269
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:43 pm

MtDNA:
U5b2b
PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 10:06 am
Gioiello wrote:And also Cabaon had the "account suspended" in Anthrogenica that very likely will be transformed in a banishment. Perhaps someone thinks that Cabaon is me, but I am not Cabaon. Jews are the same of course.


Originally Posted by Agamemnon
In other words, finding the exact same paternal lineage (found in earlier MBA and EIA samples from Israel) in a majority of Jewish priests regardless of the community (Sephardic, Ashkenazi, Mizrahi, Romaniote, Yemenite, etc) is just a happy coincidence. It had nothing to do either with the Babylonian exile or the later exile of the Jewish-Roman wars, despite its sub-branches having TMRCA estimates corresponding to both events. Just a bunch of eclectic "opportunists settling in different parts of the world"... Where I'm from, we call that a miracle.

Cabaon's answer 
I'll just point out that when Europeans owe anywhere between 30% and 50% of their autosomal ancestry to pastoralists from the steppe, many go as far as to call that an invasion. When Jews owe anywhere between 30% and 50% of their ancestry to Iron Age Israelites however, you expect us to pretend that there was no exile (for which there is ample documentation anyway, contra Sand). Without double-standards, people like you would be left with no standards at all.

P.S. If I had access to Anthrogenica I'd say to Agamemnon to post his terminal SNP of his Y and not only J-Z18271 or at least Y67, what he didn't do either when we exchanged tens of letters in the past.


It certainly was not a Steppe R1b male invasion in west/central Europe as ancient dna has shown. R1a and multiple mtdna females!!

Posts: 3177
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 4:27 pm
dartraighe wrote:It certainly was not a Steppe R1b male invasion in west/central Europe as ancient dna has shown. R1a and multiple mtdna females!!


The true question aren't only these Harvardians and their agendas, but that FTDNA thought that Gioiello Tognoni was a "stupid goy" as many persons who served him. They are falsifying all the tests and the data from their beginning. This is the fake SNP of Agamemnon:

In the J1 FTDNA project some samples are tested J-Z18271, but only one seems through a Big Y. Probably it is the sample submitted to YFull now: YF81707 (only VCF file), but it seems the only one put in the Big Y Block tree as true J-Z18271*, but through its haplotype it belongs to the J-BY172422 subclade, J-FT159488 at YFull now: https://www.yfull.com/live/tree/J-BY172422/ with a MRCA only 850 years ago.

Posts: 3269
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:43 pm

MtDNA:
U5b2b
PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 7:37 pm
Gioiello wrote:
dartraighe wrote:It certainly was not a Steppe R1b male invasion in west/central Europe as ancient dna has shown. R1a and multiple mtdna females!!


The true question aren't only these Harvardians and their agendas, but that FTDNA thought that Gioiello Tognoni was a "stupid guy" as many persons who served him. They are falsifying all the tests and the data from their beginning.



>Gio, that is not a fair comment. I don't believe that they falsified my ydna results because I have results from other dna companies which are in line with my FTDNA results.

>No one thinks that you are a stupid guy, but you don't like Jews and you like to tell the whole world that you don't.

>It is better to stick with the ydna facts and to show people that there are flaws in their arguments.

Posts: 3177
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 8:45 pm
dartraighe wrote:
>Gio, that is not a fair comment. I don't believe that they falsified my ydna results because I have results from other dna companies which are in line with my FTDNA results.

>No one thinks that you are a stupid guy, but you don't like Jews and you like to tell the whole world that you don't.

>It is better to stick with the ydna facts and to show people that there are flaws in their arguments.


Dartraighe, of course FTDNA had no interest in falsifying your test and many others. I say only that the purpose of FTDNA from the beginning was to control the tests for being sure that the truth, above all about the origin of Jews, wasn't discovered. For that this firm practised dumping (of course with many funds we may suppose from whom) for eliminating and buying all the other firms. I followed the vicissitudes of DNAHeritage and also EthnoAncestry (before British DNA) till the last with Nebula (samples are managed and controlled from FTDNA) and also what is happening with Dante labs (tests cannot be bought from Italy but through the US). I have proof that samples which may demonstrate that the great part of Jewish Y are introgressed are hidden (I spoke of the case of Del Turco), and passed only those of people convinced to be a crypto Jew etc. Look at the samples I spoke a lot about of Benassi and Garambone in J2 haplogroup. What a pity that you don't understand that the hands beyond the Harvardians with their "levantinist-kurganist-levantinist" agenda and FTDNA are the same. I spoke a lot also about National Geographic and Ancestry.com and much more. Now the link with Australian Jews for medical tests as Nebula, Dante labs etc. Hope you understood the meaning of boycotting YFull not releasing the .BAM file etc.
I didn't say a "stupid guy". "Stupid goy" is the definition that the Boss gave to all the not Jewish volunteers of FTDNA, above all to Mike Walsh, who is the only one to manage the R1b-M343 (xP312 xU106) project, mine, and not anymore great geneticists as smal (Sergey Malyshev).
If you don't understand all that (and much else) how can you realize that I fought with naked hands (and I thank you for all the help you gave me) against a Book and all human foolishness.
Last edited by Gioiello on Wed Mar 10, 2021 10:01 am, edited 3 times in total.

Posts: 3269
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:43 pm

MtDNA:
U5b2b
PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2021 8:05 am
"Go back 5000 years, and you could fit the men who left Y-DNA descendants into a large room"
Last edited by dartraighe on Thu Mar 11, 2021 12:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Posts: 3177
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2021 8:26 am
I spoke about these questions already more than 7 years ago in this blog viewtopic.php?f=71&t=909&p=16291&hilit=N112578&sid=4fd75095822e6938637497a8b4d604ee#p16291 with another of my worst opponent, Richard "The moron" Rocca, who thought he too that an Italian ancestor of his could have got a Jewish origin. This is the sample of J-Z18271 I spoke above:
N112578 Fischel Leiblum, b. 1865 Poland J1c3
12 23 14 10 13-16 11 16 11 13 11 30 17 8-9 11 11 26 14 21 26 11-15-16-17 11 10 22-22 15 14 17 19 31-34 13 9

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